Getting GS inverters out as fast as I can

8 minutes ago, The Blind Wolf said:

Ah, same thing Vioctron does. I figured that was what it should have been, but you was doing a different setup.  so boh gets wired the same way? output l1 l2 and N tro the panel?  then a l2 wir on the input for sense wire and l1 and n for charging?    So I could in theriy have two 120v charging inverters?  cause I do got another gen, a bigger one that I could use if it allow to use a none true sign wave gen as the ac for the other inverter. . .  Its a 8.5kw honda gen.

NO....inverter outputs CANNOT be wired together under any circumstances.  There's a lot less output circuitry in the GS inverters than you might think.  Only 2 wires on the input (I-L1/L and I-N/L2, depending on the input voltage configuration), and NONE of the wires can be used separately from the rest.

One inverter on one phase.  The other inverter on the other phase.  Synced 180 degrees apart. 

Only the "master" inverter can be used for battery charge, as the "slave" inverter's input is used up for the sync function.

Square wave output will be quite the problem, not to mention you'd be running your house on square wave power (runs pass-thru on charge).  GS 6kw inverter wires aren't designed to handle 8.5kw of power, either.

1 hour ago, Sid Genetry Solar said:

NO....inverter outputs CANNOT be wired together under any circumstances.  There's a lot less output circuitry in the GS inverters than you might think.  Only 2 wires on the input (I-L1/L and I-N/L2, depending on the input voltage configuration), and NONE of the wires can be used separately from the rest.

One inverter on one phase.  The other inverter on the other phase.  Synced 180 degrees apart. 

Only the "master" inverter can be used for battery charge, as the "slave" inverter's input is used up for the sync function.

Square wave output will be quite the problem, not to mention you'd be running your house on square wave power (runs pass-thru on charge).  GS 6kw inverter wires aren't designed to handle 8.5kw of power, either.

Ah, so I still wire it the same way, but you just switching the way it handle the load?  Like l1 handles the  phase on the master, and the l2 handle the phase on the slave?  Or do I need to wire it diff?  if one inverter is doing one phase, the other is doing the other, then that means I got to what wire it differently?

Oh well. I'm so confused now lol. . .  Okay I won't use the square wave  gen, since you said I can only use the master still as the charger.  Just need to make sure I'm on the same page as you as far as wireing, do I wire it the same?  Master L1 L2 and N to breaker from output?  Slave l1 and l2 to breaker from input?  or you going to have me change it lol. . .  If so I need to know before you ship, so I can get my friend over here to rewire the two breakers if that is the case.

Yeah same here in Iowa been it has getting down in the the 40s at night then 60s during the day.  Enjoying it though, not a big fan of the summer heat.

Fun hearing you guys talk things through this is a very unique situation with these inverters we get to chat and figure things.  Love the inside channel learning as we move forward.

9 hours ago, The Blind Wolf said:

Ah, so I still wire it the same way, but you just switching the way it handle the load?  Like l1 handles the  phase on the master, and the l2 handle the phase on the slave?  Or do I need to wire it diff?  if one inverter is doing one phase, the other is doing the other, then that means I got to what wire it differently?

 

Oh well. I'm so confused now lol. . .  Okay I won't use the square wave  gen, since you said I can only use the master still as the charger.  Just need to make sure I'm on the same page as you as far as wireing, do I wire it the same?  Master L1 L2 and N to breaker from output?  Slave l1 and l2 to breaker from input?  or you going to have me change it lol. . .  If so I need to know before you ship, so I can get my friend over here to rewire the two breakers if that is the case.

No breaker rewiring needed.  However, the inverters get wired up completely differently than we were originally discussing.

If we do this, both inverters will be single-phase output (120v @ 50A), basically 3 wires each (instead of 5)...though the 5-pin block will have some doubled up wires for the increased current:

1. O-L (output line)
2. N (common neutral)
3. I-L (input-line)

For system wiring, you would do the following:

Master O-L (output line) goes to one half (side, phase, whatever you call it!) of your 2-phase breaker (you'll need a single 50A 2-phase breaker for the 2 inverters).

Master N (common neutral) goes to the breaker panel neutral (and the generator neutral)

Master I-L (input line) goes to the generator output Line.  (Generator Neutral goes to your breaker panel.)

Slave N (common neutral) goes to the breaker panel neutral (same with master inverter neutral and generator neutral)

Slave O-L (output line) goes to the OTHER half of your 2-phase breaker.

Slave I-L (input line) goes to the Master O-L for sync.  Slave mode is SLAVE-SPLIT, where it will sync exactly 180 degrees apart from the input signal, thus giving you the full 240vAC output across both phases in your breaker panel.  I've split-synced 2 240v regular split-phase inverters and measured 483vAC across the 2 of them...

Master inverter will handle the generator input/generator start.  Slave inverter will produce the other phase from the battery bank while the generator is running--but obviously, you will need to drop the house loads to less than the generator's ability if you expect to get any power going INTO the batteries.

With the inverters synced 180 degrees apart, they'll both push power in opposite directions.  120v + 120v = 240v, so you get your full 240v on the breaker panel.

If they are synced 0 degrees apart, you'll end up with a net zero across the 2 phases of your breaker panel, and 240v loads simply won't get any power.

55 minutes ago, Sid Genetry Solar said:

No breaker rewiring needed.  However, the inverters get wired up completely differently than we were originally discussing.

If we do this, both inverters will be single-phase output (120v @ 50A), basically 3 wires each (instead of 5)...though the 5-pin block will have some doubled up wires for the increased current:

1. O-L (output line)
2. N (common neutral)
3. I-L (input-line)

For system wiring, you would do the following:

Master O-L (output line) goes to one half (side, phase, whatever you call it!) of your 2-phase breaker (you'll need a single 50A 2-phase breaker for the 2 inverters).

Master N (common neutral) goes to the breaker panel neutral (and the generator neutral)

Master I-L (input line) goes to the generator output Line.  (Generator Neutral goes to your breaker panel.)

Slave N (common neutral) goes to the breaker panel neutral (same with master inverter neutral and generator neutral)

Slave O-L (output line) goes to the OTHER half of your 2-phase breaker.

Slave I-L (input line) goes to the Master O-L for sync.  Slave mode is SLAVE-SPLIT, where it will sync exactly 180 degrees apart from the input signal, thus giving you the full 240vAC output across both phases in your breaker panel.  I've split-synced 2 240v regular split-phase inverters and measured 483vAC across the 2 of them...

 

Master inverter will handle the generator input/generator start.  Slave inverter will produce the other phase from the battery bank while the generator is running--but obviously, you will need to drop the house loads to less than the generator's ability if you expect to get any power going INTO the batteries.

 

With the inverters synced 180 degrees apart, they'll both push power in opposite directions.  120v + 120v = 240v, so you get your full 240v on the breaker panel.

If they are synced 0 degrees apart, you'll end up with a net zero across the 2 phases of your breaker panel, and 240v loads simply won't get any power.

Okay, will I be able to add another gs down the road from doing this if 12k isn't enough?

also the slave L1 in goes to Master l2 out?  what to make sure you wrote it diff.

also, is 10 gauge wire going to handle 50a?  thats a lot of power for a 10.  sounds like I need to upgrade to a 8 and get a 50a double pole breaker instead of the two 25as I got in, well at least the opens up two slots.

Also, I still getting the gen 2 gs right with the cover?  and on the block I'm guessing it goes from up to down   out l1 n l2  input l1 l2 ?

I   think  daisy chain  2 GS  inverters  as 110vac single phase   master and slave  would be a better way   to get  12kw  split phase 240 vac    I   do not  think  I can do that with 2  110vac single phase  powerjack  inveters  as there is no charging input  .    

Well if that will work, maybe sean can get my gs out the door today. . .  Just make sure he remebers to put a ribbion on the master gs so I know its the master when I setup.

Power Jack inverters don't have any ability to sync to an AC waveform.  Strictly a GS feature 😉.  That sync function is also how you can get 3-phase with GS inverters...sync 2 other inverters 120 and 240 degrees off the "master".

This technically isn't "daisy chaining" 2 GS inverters...rather it's running them in split-phase sync mode, 180 degrees apart.  No power sharing takes place.

will have to talk with Sean, he'd have to swap the 24v fans to the new inverters.  But before this is concluded as a solution for your needs, we need to be on the same page as to how this all goes together.

@the-blind-wolfThere is no "L1" and "L2" on an inverter that's been set up for single-phase output.

Likely the terminal block would be (top to bottom):

O-L

N

O-L

N

I-L

45 minutes ago, The Blind Wolf said:

Okay, will I be able to add another gs down the road from doing this if 12k isn't enough?

Umm...no.  But down the road we might be able to get you a 12kw setup if needed...after I get the design ordered and working...

46 minutes ago, The Blind Wolf said:

 

also the slave L1 in goes to Master l2 out?  what to make sure you wrote it diff.

There is no L1 / L2 on an inverter set up for single-phase.  Just L and N.  Yes, this is an internal rewiring of the inverter.

46 minutes ago, The Blind Wolf said:

also, is 10 gauge wire going to handle 50a?  thats a lot of power for a 10.  sounds like I need to upgrade to a 8 and get a 50a double pole breaker instead of the two 25as I got in, well at least the opens up two slots.

I'd agree about the 8AWG and 50a double-pole breaker.  Yeah, I told you 2 25A breakers awhile back, haha, if I'd thought of this earlier, you'd have your pups already 😉

 I   can not  open the case to change  240vac splitphase   GS inverter to 110vac singlephase     Do  I   need to order  2 GS  110vac  single phase  inverter  to  make  12kw  240vac splitphase  with the wifi board ?   Thank you  for  another way to get 12kw  .    

Do you have a Genetry Solar inverter?  (This functionality is not possible with a Power Jack inverter.)

No  I   was waiting for  the daisy chain of the GS  6kw 240vac splitphase  since november 2020  to be working  before ordering .  NO  my  15kw powerjack  can not be daisy chain but is working good at  5000 watts  .   I  am waiting  for different ideas .   Thank you .  

1 hour ago, Sid Genetry Solar said:

I'd agree about the 8AWG and 50a double-pole breaker.

Good call man, Yeah don't be tempted to parallel 10AWG wires on the mains side.  Not that we are trying to follow code, but makes sense to just don't do it if you can would be nice to do things to code as much as possible to keep things safer.