PowerJack 30000Watt 48volt LF SP PSW 2 box inverter 2021 model 189 pounds

1 hour ago, pilgrimvalley said:

if the 12k inverter is 90 percent efficient and wastes 1000 watts or more per hour as heat due to the inefficiency.....

it is most efficient at full throttle correct???

at half throttle>>> say 6000 watts in the 12k inverter>>>> is the wasted power of the inverter still 1000 plus watts of waste heat or is it some number/amount less???

have you measured this at all??? just curious.....

We don't have equipment to technically measure these numbers, so we make educated guesses based on what we can measure with clamp meters, etc

The 12kw inverter hopefully will be >92% efficient, if not closer to 94-95% (as I've tweaked the transformer spec a bit further on the production spec manual).  Mathematically I calculated 95% efficiency from the current prototype transformer alone on a purely resistive basis...and I've beefed the spec a tad beyond that.  Transformer might measure at 96% or so for production units.  FETs aren't losing much power, as they barely need any cooling at full 12kw load (calculated ~41W.)

Efficiency will in theory be highest at mid loading, NOT full throttle.  Reason is simple: the resistive temperature coefficient of the actual transformer windings--the hotter they get, the more resistance they have, which makes them get hotter yet....

...so the cooler the transformer is, the higher the efficiency will be, resulting from reduced losses.

1 hour ago, pilgrimvalley said:

yes, I think a 12k 48-volt inverter is not adequate for his needs (Sean) and since they are not parallelable >>> he would have to run multiple inverters, each on its own breaker panel and not interconnected. 

Parallel functionality is in the works.  I just simply haven't been able to get any serious work on the code, as I'm just maxed out trying to get the spec manual written and illustrated.  And until the code is written/tested, it's not possible.

1 hour ago, pilgrimvalley said:

I can't wait to see the 4 12k inverters running on Sean's wall with the dozen or more el cheapo MPPTs...🤔 4 inverters wasting 1000 plus watts an hour as heat would be the equivalent of running two 2000 watt electric space heaters in the small space he is talking of enclosing....that will help the efficiency...ok with cold leaky walls in the winter but a big problem in the summer.....getting rid of the excess heat is the problem with multiple big inverters...🤔🤔😎

Losses won't be anything close to that high.  But even if they were, he's got a heat pump hot water heater that tends to freeze him out...so any waste heat gets used anyway.

an interesting thing he (Ray Builds Cool Stuff) did was add a soft start to reduce the heat pump draw from 50 amps to 19 amps ...maybe that would help a bit with your heat pump.

Engineering 775  was so happy that  2 HF inverters 15 kw in parallel  and soft starter  starts a 5 ton heat pump .   Now that is  30 kw  out of 2 inverters and cost 17000  dollars  and 300 dollars for soft starter .  I am not happy with that as one GS  12 kw  can start a 5 ton heat pump without soft starter for 3000 dollars .     

i have one of those chargers/testeres for the LiFePO4 cells but i really like the Riden 6024 bench charger and Riden 6018 bench charger for the LeFePO4 cells... i charged 4 at a time in Parallel....

yes the high voltage equipment is interesting but maybe not in my budget at the moment either...

yes, the solark type HF inverters are very spendy for sure... i thought maybe the soft starter would be a way to decrease the high amp draw from your heat pump... not necessarily getting the expensive solark type HF inverters.....

I would not buy the expensive solark type HF inverter either....🤔

yes the scam salesmen who promote 6k inverters to run other than the hermits house when they really need 20k peak power should be avoided... 🤣

who wants to babysit their battery and inverter 24/7... not me so bigger is better.... or insulate and reduce usage would be my 1st priority... but i want my family to use whatever whenever without problems....trying to have a backup for the system for the long term...🤔😎

running at half throttle vs balls to the wall while still having the ability to run more when needed....😎

that sounds interesting albeit an expensive hot water heater to buy i am guessing....

i hope to utilize the excess solar pv production to heat the water....just need the water tanks at the moment....want steel tanks to insulate so i can heat water a bit hotter....right now I have a propane hot water heater...in the basement made for dwarfs....i essentially never go down there....good for 5 feet tall people maybe...

.right now I have a propane hot water heater...in the basement made for dwarfs....i essentially never go down there....good for 5 feet tall people maybe.

I  remember  the hot water heater  in a hole in the  ground call a basement when I  was in Minnesota  long time ago  and it  was  scary  to go down  as a kid .      Salamanders  make thier home  down there .   

i have one of those chargers/testeres for the LiFePO4 cells but i really like the Riden 6024 bench charger and Riden 6018 bench charger for the LeFePO4 cells... i charged 4 at a time in Parallel.

Thank you for the information ,      Riden 6024 bench charger is what I  can use to charge my battery in two hours instead of using  e-bike charging taken  12 hours .   

yes, my wife is afraid of spiders and anything that crawls.. me >>> I do not like to work in places that I can not stand up in without banging my head into the floor joists....so out to the garage or barn before any basement adventures....

I see the gs12k is now priced at $2999 plus tax; so this is more than the sungold power 12000 watt ($2649)and close to the sigineer 12k inverters' price ($3399)....but Sean says they may have a 90 to 120 day wait time on the gs12k if all the parts come through in a timely fashion...and Sean is back to praising powerjack-jack.....???

maybe praising them (powerjack-jack) will help their final wholesale price....🤔🤔....powerjack-helen said she quit....

the steep barn roof has now caught my eye as the place to mount some more solar panels...it has a 25 year old white steel roof on it...and faces south....the ground mount structures have been ok, but the South Dakota wind has been super fierce at times and worries me...i have the ballasted and also attached to a wood fence post....but the roofstill looks like less materials to buy for mounting more of the solar panels....

have a great Wednesday😎

 Sean says they may have a 90 to 120 day wait time on the gs12k if all the parts come through in a timely fashion...and Sean is back to praising powerjack-jack.....?      I will wait till next year before deciding on any  12 kw inverter .   From  OCT to  MAY  now I  can run  24/7 with my 15 kw PJ  on many  days .    I do not think  I  can get a  GS inverter  before NOV  and most likely by DEC .   I  work in manufacturing  and  it cost less to make  500 pieces than to make  2 pieces .  That mean  JACK of PJ  will be able to  negotiate  a better price and get the parts  as Sean say  he can not get the parts without  JACK help  .       The challenge is  the manufacturer  or JACK  may  change the price  and still can not  get the right  parts  and praising JACK  only after the  one production  GS 12kw  satisfly  Sean as he  do the final  inspection according to youtube .    

if it becomes a 5000 dollar inverter improved aluminum core toroidal lf inverter w/ wifi due to powerjack-jack jacking up the prices,,,,,they will no longer be able to sell them for 2999....

the sungold power can connect 9 of the 6000 watt ones together but they cost about $1500 each....not sure if the sungold power 12k can be connected to more than one??

they will no longer be able to sell them for 2999....

Sean say  the GS 12kw will be over  2999 after the pre-order  according  to his updated  youtube .    With taxes added it is  now over 3000  dollars on the pre-order .        

The sungold power 12k can NOT  be connected to more than one .     I am waiting  for  2  GS 6kw 240VAC  inverters to be parallel .    I  will need a lot more solar panels  to run any 12 kw inverter  for more than  8 hours  and  at 100 degree F  maybe only  4 hours   because  the maximun  load  drop 10 to 20 percent for every 10 degree increase  from google search   so  a  sungold may do 12000 watt at 70 degree F  but the maximun load will be maybe a 30 percent drop to only do 8400 watt at  100 degree F  and maybe more like 50 percent drop to only do 6000 watts  because of the transformer heat .      That is why  no inverter can do  run continuous at 120 degree  F  and  one on this forum  try and burn the shed  down  and he say to delete what he show but  not possible  as I will not say  who it is .    

South Dakota sales tax is 6 to 7&1/2 percent so that adds another 210 bucks or more, so definitely over 3 grand ....

have they done any testing of how many decibels the fans are??? sound noise??? 

at high load just how much noise do they output....???

we had noise meters at work and wore hearing protectors in the noisy work areas....

i always hear Sean saying they are causing the noise in the back ground...of his YouTube videos......and he is eventually going to wall them off to decrease the background noise issues...of his YouTube videos...

 I can't hear my inverter fans as they are in a separate outside solar shed,,, but would be a consideration when in the house/basement /living quarters if people put them there....

for me I like it quiet for watching news/movies/YouTube videos etc., and studying things...

I never see any inverter talk/specify about waste heat but Sean said his was about 137 degrees so definitely adding heat to the room at 8000 watt load,,,,on his gs12k inverter....

possibly the inverter would produce 800 watts of waste electrical heat or more when running 8000 watt load....need to air-condition it except maybe in winter when it is cold outside....

seems most things are rated and tested at 77 degrees F (or 25 degrees C)  .....a reasonable room temperature....I know the performance seems to go downhill at higher ambient temperatures....

seems most things are rated and tested at 77 degrees F (or 25 degrees C)  .....a reasonable room temperature....I know the performance seems to go downhill at higher ambient temperatures..            possibly the inverter would produce 800 watts of waste electrical heat or more when running 8000 watt load....need to air-condition it except maybe in winter when it is cold outside..                                I  only  use  2   Delta fans  on my  15 kw PJ  inverter now  with one blowing  at  the  transformer  and one blowing  parallel with the heat sink  at the FETs  .   I  had 7 fans blowing and make no difference so  now only 2  so I  can use all   night .       Google search  say  all  transformer  rated  for 12 kw is at 70 degree F  for continuous  use .    The rating  will drop  10  to  20  percent for every 10 degree F increase in temperature  .    A high effiency  transformer will drop  30 percent and  max out at  8400 watts at  100 degree F .        Most people do not know that the inverter  need  air-condition in summer  or it will shut down automatically  or if the temperature  sensor  FAILED then  the  house will  burn down  if OVERLOADED  .                     I  was surprise that David  know  about the PJ  false advertising on ebay  as  he say in the negative review  comment that  ebay buyer should read the small print  and load the PJ  inverter  one half of the 120vac  load .    

so in reality a 15k inverter should not be ran higher than 7500 watts and a 12k should not be ran at higher than 6000 watts and at high temperatures they will not be able to sustain anywhere near that amount of output so false hype from the venders...

where as the 25k Sandi high voltage inverter can do 25k at the high voltage as it does not overheat and is not taxed as bad but then again he cools the inverter and components room to somewhere near 72 degrees F.

so when Sean reported the lessor performance it was due to the higher heat in his equipment room...I can not wait till he runs 4 and the heat will be increased significantly,,,, but I think maybe he will only be able to run them at low wattage without the battery and solar panel capacity....maybe only idle them along at 6000 watts per 12k gs inverter or so...

for me the high voltage pre-built battery was a huge expensive stumbling block but may still be a better way as the step up voltage is less taxing to all the equipment and would be more efficient with less wasted inverter electrical heat...

I priced the 30k sandi  and high voltage MPPT and 34kW prebuilt LiFePO4 battery with BMS >>>> about 20000 dollars delivered....I may have to price only the 30k sandi inverter next....

the high priced pre-built LiFEPO4 battery still makes me think building the battery would be a lot less money but has an increased danger/ respect factor...

would need to complete in 2022 to get the federal tax credit of 26 percent though...

where as the 25k Sandi high voltage inverter can do 25k at the high voltage as it does not overheat and is not taxed as bad but then again he cools the inverter and components room to somewhere near 72 degrees F.

You and I  found the answer to why  the inverter need  be in a shed  and air-conditioned .   I will  make a  box  and           air-condition  my inverter  as it just shut down now and the patio concrete is 130 degree  .     Sean with 4 inverters  will need  a portable AC to cool his  basement  plus the inverter water heater .         Sandi  done actual test  with different  transformer  and  on their website show  10 to 20 percent  drop in rated load  for every 10 degree increase in room temperature .        Mike G  found that  his first  Sandi 20kw  will only do 17kw at 100 degree F .     He now recommend  a  Sandi  30 kw if he do  over  with pre-built  battery and 400 Vdc .    EVTV  also  recommend  Sandi 30kw at 400Vdc for  shop or farm .   My BMW  65vdc   battery  was shipped  6 in series for 400 Vdc .    IT took 6 days from  PA to PHX  by freight .  The  battery sit at the PHX  terminal  for 10 days  and I ask  why .   The girl say it took that long to find a driver willing to deliver hazard material  to home .     Shipping was 600 dollars  and the freight company do not care .