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Just consider that 8000W a model number.
I am throwing in with that J McDonald guy (amazon review) on the not starting motors much ; Bought one of these LYABE 8000W/ 32000W Peak Pure Sine Wave Power Inverter 24V DC to 120/240V AC Split Phase with Battery AC Chargers to add well pump to the solar side ; Got a return fixer upper that had been thru the fedex treatment - lot of bent up metal is all, inside looked good with connections all tight and so on ; Fired it up - replaced a blown fuse or two - good voltage etc on the LCD ;
Time to have some popcorn - starving, had none since the reliableelectric 3000W went down in the storms month ago - pop, pop - LCD saying 1350W (machine box says 1475W, oh well) ; Ok, may have gotten lucky on the "fixer upper" ;
Time to run a load of laundry - old machine calls for a 20A socket - filled, then choked when starting the motor - on retries, got 5 or 10 secs - inverter did save itself, did reset itself quickly - well hell - reliableelectric 3000W ran washer just fine ; Prolly only half the transformer - guess need PJ AMG - will try again manana in full sun ;
Today, 28 Sep, tried again about 11ish (nice praisetherays day), victron saying 28.xx on the batts - no dice, restart gets 10 or 15 secs - damn ; Also ditched the plug and put the wire in the 240v port below - not sure if L1 or L2, but the shutdown still working ;
So, my questions are:
1. How do I make this POS an AMG to use both sides of the transformer for 120V ??
1a. Where does the sine get flipped for 240v L2 ? Can I tap in there before that to combine ?
2. Where is the weak point - mosfets look puny - pretty in there though ?? .
2a. WTF PJ ??
1. How do I make this POS an AMG to use both sides of the transformer for 120V ?? 1a. Where does the sine get flipped for 240v L2 ? Can I tap in there before that to combine ?
So a split-phase secondary is a center-tapped coil. Neutral is the center tap, and L1 / L2 are the 2 ends. This is what causes the "flippage"--there is no circuitry on the inverter itself causing this. It's a hardware winding of the transformer.
Could you provide a photo of the internals of the inverter? There's a chance if it's a newer designed transformer that they might have copied GS spec and put the secondaries already separated. If not, you'd have to split the secondaries where they're joined together--and know what you're doing. These transformers are wound with aluminum, not copper--so you won't be able to solder to it. You would need crimp terminals and crimpers to do any work on them.
...and I can't say that "AMG'ing" it to single-phase is going to make an improvement either. Clothes washers have been somewhat problematic even for GS inverters with tight specs.
2. Where is the weak point - mosfets look puny - pretty in there though ?? . 2a. WTF PJ ??
Weak point? Everywhere 😉.
Seriously, though, the FETs are pretty decent. Just everything surrounding them leaves something to be desired.
... Uh-oh, this place just became the go-to for Lyabe inverters. LOL
Split-Phase is Single Phase, just with two windings (or two halves of one winding...) added in series.
It's easy to understand by imagining two batteries in series. If you put one voltmeter probe in the middle, you will get one positive reading and one negative reading as the other probe is moved between the opposite ends. This might be what you can think of as the "flip". Except in AC, since it's alternating, they alternate opposite to one another.
If you want to convert it into 120v.. hopefully you have two high voltage windings on the tranny. In which case you just wire the two windings in parallel rather than in series.
and I can't say that "AMG'ing" it to single-phase is going to make an improvement either.
The new AMG with 6 wires transformer is the most useless inverter for inductive load according to youtuber video . Your rebuilt Lyabe doing 1400 watts is about the best for any AMG 8KW made by PJ and PJ is Powerjack that sell AMG inverter on ebay . My 3 years old PJ 8kw has 40 FETs and can do 3500 watts with ASL4.0 transformer .
Aha, getting educated here - good deal, lol ; have some pics but not enough - that tag over by transformer and a version ( have heard it on driver board and from another on the bottom side of the main board ) for today here in a little ;
Holycrap, sounds wonderful on the old PJ 8kw ; Really have no clue what all they did for AMG - just believe that gets more 120vac out ; Well yeh, saying PJ - not saying the Lyabe word anymore, lol ;
Guess back to the beginning on this 240vac and split phase inverters ; Thought I learned (recently, relative to my seventy years) that 240vac has the two legs in opposite "phase" or sine direction ; Is that what you are saying NotMario - do I have that part right ? And, hence the need for those magic combiners for running two little gennys together for 240vac ;
Sidadmin, ok, got it on the no circuitry needed ; "aluminum, not copper" - Dang, news is not improving.... ; Ok, on the clothes washers - need to get "more lucky" and just call the "laundry service" maybe ; How about "soft start" - have a 4kw here for well pump - have considered wiring one leg thru to check that out but fearing it may let the smoke out and I will have to be depressed for a little, lol
Ok, going to pull the lid and look more ;
Really have no clue what all they did for AMG - just believe that gets more 120vac out
AMG has a 6 wires transformer . Powerjsck lie about getting more 120vac out but actually the AMG output less . 1400 watt is good . ASL4.0 is a good 5 wires transformer in the Lyabe but the 11.x control board and LF driver is a problem . The main board connector can be a problem if need to repair and difficult to get parts to repair older inverter that do not have rev 11.3 control board .
Really have no clue what all they did for AMG - just believe that gets more 120vac out
The only real change for "AMG" inverters is to copy the GS spec on the transformer secondary winding 🤪.
Basically, that gives 2 120v secondaries that can be put in series for 240v split-phase, or put in parallel for 120v single-phase. The PJ inverters handle this by only ever regulating from 120v--which means that the "other phase" is pretty much unregulated. (I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't even have an AC filter cap on it!)
Even if your Lyabe only has 3 secondary wires on the transformer, there's a high likelihood you'll be able to split them apart. However, that's when the real issues start: because if the 2 120v phases aren't voltage-matched (which PJ tends not to do--they'll often be as much as 8-12v apart!) you can't parallel them without causing a lot of heat, power loss and inefficiency. Adding insult to injury, if your PJ regulates from 240v, you're kinda stuck--because changing it to 120v requires SMD soldering and SMD resistor. (I've personally never done that to a PJ board...and don't want to.)
Depends how dirty you want to get your hands, haha 😉.
Ok, on the clothes washers - need to get "more lucky" and just call the "laundry service" maybe
I personally haven't had issues with washing machines and off-grid inverters (PJ or GS)...and I've only had "technologically intense" HE washers with pushbutton controls--i.e. not the old mechanical washers that would run on bootleg power if you had it! Several other customers report very persnickety washing machines even on GS inverters (refusing to complete a wash cycle, randomly stopping in the middle)--and unfortunately, as none of them live nearby (nor do they have test equipment!), I have not been able to determine why. Sometimes more AC output filtration solves the issue--and sometimes not.
Thought I learned (recently, relative to my seventy years) that 240vac has the two legs in opposite "phase" or sine direction ; Is that what you are saying NotMario - do I have that part right ?
It's difficult to explain, and perhaps as a result it's very easy to get confused with 240v split-phase...
In short, you always have a "single phase 240v" sine wave across L1 and L2.
A center tap on the 240v winding gives you a "Neutral" line, and also with that two separate 120v potentials between L1 - N and L2 - N. However, the AC phase between L1 - N and L2 - N is going to be 180 degrees. Note that if you short L1 and L2 together, you've deadshorted the transformer secondary to zero--as that's the 240v single-phase sine.
And, hence the need for those magic combiners for running two little gennys together for 240vac ;
Any AC signal has to be synchronized to avoid loggerheads competitions between the gennies to see which one can blow the other one up faster 😉. And if you're trying to put 2 120v gennies together for a 240v output, they do have to be synced 180 degrees apart--otherwise you'll have no 240v.
Guess back to the beginning on this 240vac and split phase inverters ; Thought I learned (recently, relative to my seventy years) that 240vac has the two legs in opposite "phase" or sine direction ; Is that what you are saying NotMario - do I have that part right ? And, hence the need for those magic combiners for running two little gennys together for 240vac ;
It's hard to explain in text.
There is only one phase.
Essentially you have a single winding on which a magnetic field is applying a potential.
Voltage is merely the difference in potential. If you take that single winding, and put the probes on opposite ends, you end up with 240v. When you place a probe in the center, and the other on either of the two ends, you end up with 120v - but because it's relative to the center, when one end is positive, the other end is negative relative to the center.
I'll link a circuit simulator here in a bit that should make it crystal clear what's going on.
A pair of generators is different - you have two completely separate single-phase circuits that first need to be synchronized. Not because the phases need to be opposite, but because they need to be the same!
Take a look here:
Note the two halves have the same voltage and polarity. Add them together in series, unsurprisingly, you get double the voltage.
On the other hand, add them in parallel...
... and you get the same voltage, but double the amperage capability instead.
Ok, pics from today - have more if needed - staying to the transformer wiring and board identification ; Looks like all in reverse order of choosing - ok ; The socket tester (gfci +) is showing the neutral and line reversed on the 120v receptacles - is part of what made me switch to the 240v port connection yesterday ; On the first (last here) is the single white coming off transformer to the back of the panel - all others on other side in bundle with the choke (or actually maybe sensor) ; Until tomorrow ;
forgot the tag
Ok, pics from today - have more if needed
You has a AMG 6 wires transformer . There are 2 separate 120vac windings YEL-BLK and YEL-BLK . My PJ inverter outlet is also wired reverse and I re-wired it so it is correct L1 N . A new 24v rev 11.3 control board will replace your old rev 11.3 control board since it is alresdy removed . This inverter will be fun to play with . I can add 10uf capacitor to L2 N . I can make 2 separate 120vac outlets . Connect the 2 N wires together and have split-phase 240vac .
Have to admit i'm baffled by the ASL4 vs ASL3 tranny. Isn't an ASL4 supposed to be larger?
My ASL3 looks like it has at least double the number of wires going into the choke... And sadly only wrapped around once, with zero spare room to wrap it a second time... :c
Maybe i should get a bigger choke.
Have to admit i'm baffled by the ASL4 vs ASL3 tranny. Isn't an ASL4 supposed to be larger
I was surprise to see a AMG 6 wires ASL4.0 transformer in the Lyabe . My 5 wires ASL4.0 is larger because the wires diameter is bigger and more wires per bundle . The new AMG transformer will do 1/4 or less of the 8kw advertise . Powerjack only sell the rev 11.3 control board so people will hhave a very hard time repairing older PJ inverter but Sid will have no problem since the Lyabe copy GS spec except the windings of the transformer use too small diameter of wires .
8 hours ago, NotMario said:Have to admit i'm baffled by the ASL4 vs ASL3 tranny. Isn't an ASL4 supposed to be larger?
By a couple frogs' hairs.
8 hours ago, NotMario said:My ASL3 looks like it has at least double the number of wires going into the choke... And sadly only wrapped around once, with zero spare room to wrap it a second time... :c
Is there room on the other primary lead?
<a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="/profile/193-praisetherays/?do=hovercard" data-mentionid="193" href="/profile/193-praisetherays/" rel="">@praisetheraysCan we get an "overview" of the transformer/control board all wired up (instead of all these closeups)?
I can't tell whether the transformer has 2 "115v secondaries" (a la "AMG"), or whether it's wired as a center-tapped secondary. Also can't tell if the control board is regulating from 120v or 240v...