PLEASE NOTE: If you had an account with the previous forum, it has been ported to the new Genetry website!
You will need to reset the password to access the new forum. Click Log In → Forgot Password → enter your username or forum email address → click Email Reset Link.
@the-blind-wolfseems to have 2 problems really. 1, washing machine won't run unless there is an additional load on the inverter; 2, some appliances are noisy when battery voltage is low. The washing machine is an interesting one and not directly related to battery voltage otherwise an additional load would make it worse. The noisy appliance one is quite possibly being cause by low battery voltage as the AC waveform peaks, ie, the battery or some other component of the DC supply to the inverter is not up to the task at hand. At least that's my take on things.
I have direct wire fon neg with thre 0/1 awg wire each from one 24v set, then postive I have two of the 24v set going to one 24v set batt useing same size wire, then same size wire going to a 400amp t fuse then to gs. This is all basicly direct. no switch between, then mksb charger is wired to one of the batts to charge. I check voltage o n each batt while under load and compared it to what the gs was reporting and its correct, each 12v is the same voltage as well, so no inbalance on that. I have 2 31group deep cycle agm, and 4 31group tractor batt from my big box truck which I used to use on a 12v system pulling over 400 amps under a full load.
A Google search shows that group 31 batteries are often around 100AH but can be higher rated but since you don't say I'll assume 100AH. Since you didn't actually say I'll assume you have 1 x 2 of the deep cycle batteries in series and 2 x 2 tractor batteries in series; arranged in parallel.
The deep cycle batteries would probably give you 100AH at the 20 hour rate.
The tractor batteries, well, what exactly is a tractor battery? It's probably heavy cranking batteries to start a recalcitrant diesel. If so they aren't intended to prop up sustained loads over hours rather supply bulk current for minutes at a time. Amp hours there when used as a storage battery? God only knows.
Short term amps available at 1C, ie running the AGMs hard, 300. Load distribution over the 3 24V batteries, God only knows since the batteries are intended for very different roles. The voltages on the 24v sets will by definition be nigh on identical since they are paralleled with the difference being millivolts as determined by drop in the wiring. If there was a volt of difference I'd be quite concerned with the wiring.
In the short term the overall battery bank should be fine with 80A, in the long term ie once the battery becomes discharged to a reasonable degree, I'm guessing not so much. The tractor batteries will be running out of puff putting more load onto the AGMs. A clamp meter on the wiring between the 12V batteries in each 24V string will show the average of what is going on there but not the fine detail.
A measurement of the AC ripple at the inverter's input along with the average DC reading will tell exactly what the inverter is having to cope with in terms of voltage. Let's say you have a DC reading of 23V and a ripple reading of 800mV. Your DC supply is now dipping to 22.2V and that goes into the territory where Sid has stated the GS can't hold a clean sinewave, ie the peaks will be getting clipped.
Let's say you have a DC reading of 23V and a ripple reading of 800mV. Your DC supply is now dipping to 22.2V and that goes into the territory where Sid has stated the GS can't hold a clean sinewave, ie the peaks will be getting clipped.
The AGM battery in series sag fast and the AC output will be too low to run the washer or ice machine make a lot of noise . AGM battery 4 in parallel do not sag and hold the 14v and the 12v inverter output will be a sine wave . My 4 AGM in series if drop to 50 volts will then drop to 44 v in 5 minutes and the 48v inverter will shut down if I do not go outside to switchh on more lithium ion battery . That when the LED light wil flicker and I had to run outside fast or the inverter shutdown with red light alarm .
Sag comes down to current vs battery. 4 AGMs in parallel will sag if you put too heavy a load on them.
1 hour ago, TheButcher said:The tractor batteries, well, what exactly is a tractor battery? It's probably heavy cranking batteries to start a recalcitrant diesel. If so they aren't intended to prop up sustained loads over hours rather supply bulk current for minutes at a time. Amp hours there when used as a storage battery? God only knows.
Just fairly inexpensive, LA, high CCA batteries. Not designed for deep discharge. Suitable for off grid if you baby them. I use them for surge demand.
FWIW, the price of cheap LiFePO4's are pretty comparable to AGMs when you take into account round-trip efficiency (90% vs 80%) and practical capacity (90% vs 50%), and superior when you look at EFCs. (>10K w/ optimized SOC range vs ... 500??)
If batteries are dogging ya, just buy the LIs and call it a day. It's not worth settling when the basic numbers are 3.5$/AH vs 1$/AH.
The main reason to not use them is when you can't provide reasonable environmental conditions. (particularly when can't prevent freezing conditions)
Batteries are definitely not the problem with his washing machine, though.
22 minutes ago, dickson said:The AGM battery in series sag fast and the AC output will be too low to run the washer or ice machine make a lot of noise . AGM battery 4 in parallel do not sag and hold the 14v and the 12v inverter output will be a sine wave.
Voltage sag should be relatively the same for a relatively sized load with relatively sized bank and wiring, no matter how many you have in series. I use a 24v system because 24v alternators are widely available. I'd love to use 48v, but 48v alternators are a bit exotic. 🙂
On 2/26/2022 at 12:37 PM, Sid Genetry Solar said:
- [C] add input/output amperage sensor calibrations (due to unexpected extreme variance in sensors)
- You may need to calibrate the sensors after installing the update!
Great!
Glad to hear that the amp calibration will be available. I am certain my GS reads a fair bit low. I managed to "overheat" the unit in 40f ambient without it registering an overload. Figure it's just reading low and thus didn't recognize the overload condition.
A Google search shows that group 31 batteries are often around 100AH but can be higher rated but since you don't say I'll assume 100AH. Since you didn't actually say I'll assume you have 1 x 2 of the deep cycle batteries in series and 2 x 2 tractor batteries in series; arranged in parallel.
Yes, the big batts are rated for over 100ah, just with a lot of cranking amps, like I said used them on my 24ft box truck with a 12v system running a AC, lights and two freezers.
after a good sunny day today I just got the batts charged up to 29.2 v, and its not een dropping in voltage while under a load at the moment.
I also did a whole house test, to see what that master will be mainly running in the house, come to find out. it won't be running the washer, or frig, or anything in the kitchen, just the basic stuff in the bed rooms from what I could find running, so that tells me my Slave is going to be the work horse on my panel when it ocmes to runing kitchen and washer and so forth, the only time the master will be hit the hardest, is when a 240v load kick on, and the only thing I have that it uses that is my 3 ton system, water heater and dryier. since I don't use a stove any more.
so once I get my lfo all arranged and setup, that should be a good thing.
FWIW, the price of cheap LiFePO4's are pretty comparable to AGMs when you take into account round-trip efficiency (90% vs 80%) and practical capacity (90% vs 50%), and superior when you look at EFCs. (>10K w/ optimized SOC range vs ... 500??) If batteries are dogging ya, just buy the LIs and call it a day. It's not worth settling when the basic numbers are 3.5$/AH vs 1$/AH. The main reason to not use them is when you can't provide reasonable environmental conditions. (particularly when can't prevent freezing conditions)
lifepo4 is much better suited to the solar life too. They don't care about being PSOC cycled, don't have the long dwindling tail current of lead acid batteries and don't need a generator available to bring them up to full charge if solar is lacking for several days / a week.
Is this firmware update ready for installation? If so I am having trouble seeing the update. I have the original 1a inverter that was upgraded to the c board last summer.
Is this firmware update ready for installation? If so I am having trouble seeing the update. I have the original 1a inverter that was upgraded to the c board last summer.
You'll need an active WiFi connection (with the MQTT config set to the default "wifi.genetrysolar.com"), and need to set the "Update Branch" to "Revision." (It won't show up on Major or Minor.) If it's not on Revision, then set it to Revision...exit the WiFi page and restart the inverter. Should show up when it reconnects.
Thank you Sid. Probably something with the mqtt I will have to check it out tonight.
Thank you Sid. Probably something with the mqtt I will have to check it out tonight.
Can you confirm from the "Stat" page that you do indeed have a Rev. C control board? Rev. C didn't start shipping until Fall last year--it was still under development in the summer.
I haven't released 1.1r6 for Rev A.1 / B boards yet.
I do have the rev c. Board. I was having trouble charging last fall and we up graded the board. So I have tried everything you said and still can't get the update to appear. I took some pics. Checked the MQTT and it was correct. Also I think we had this problem after the rev. C install and you pushed me the 1.1r5 update through the tech update also thought 1.1r5 was released after my install (later that day). This is kinda strange I usually see the updates (even the ones I not suppose install).
<a href="/monthly_2022_03/20220305_011301.jpg.578456097ea4487747a80e098eed14e8.jpg" class="ipsAttachLink ipsAttachLink_image"><img data-fileid="1165" src="//forums.genetrysolar.com/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" data-src="/monthly_2022_03/20220305_011301.thumb.jpg.cb75078f50e150c0b0148344b9ebbfc4.jpg" data-ratio="74.9" width="1000" class="ipsImage ipsImage_thumbnailed" alt="20220305_011301.jpg">
<a href="/monthly_2022_03/20220305_010855.jpg.848e0f4efdebe5e6f476f30691978468.jpg" class="ipsAttachLink ipsAttachLink_image"><img data-fileid="1166" src="//forums.genetrysolar.com/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" data-src="/monthly_2022_03/20220305_010855.thumb.jpg.6205553766d8f6d4d8635c7e6d033552.jpg" data-ratio="74.9" width="1000" class="ipsImage ipsImage_thumbnailed" alt="20220305_010855.jpg">
<a href="/monthly_2022_03/20220305_011132.jpg.1a816492443ed2376d741a927e1653e5.jpg" class="ipsAttachLink ipsAttachLink_image"><img data-fileid="1167" src="//forums.genetrysolar.com/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" data-src="/monthly_2022_03/20220305_011132.thumb.jpg.65ff0cb80743d6bc14743e642160dc28.jpg" data-ratio="74.9" width="1000" class="ipsImage ipsImage_thumbnailed" alt="20220305_011132.jpg">
I do have the rev c. Board. I was having trouble charging last fall and we up graded the board. So I have tried everything you said and still can't get the update to appear. I took some pics. Checked the MQTT and it was correct. Also I think we had this problem after the rev. C install and you pushed me the 1.1r5 update through the tech update also thought 1.1r5 was released after my install (later that day). This is kinda strange I usually see the updates (even the ones I not suppose install).
Well, turns out the problem was entirely my fault...when I thought I RELEASED the update, I only put it on the TECH channel.
Fixed that--you should see 1.1r6 now 😉.
Still giving me problems. I've tried switching to a different channel and switching back to rev. When I go to the wifi screen after setting to rev. and after rebooting the inverter the lcd says (up to date), then says new version, then checking file, and then goes back to saying (up to date).
Still giving me problems. I've tried switching to a different channel and switching back to rev. When I go to the wifi screen after setting to rev. and after rebooting the inverter the lcd says (up to date), then says new version, then checking file, and then goes back to saying (up to date).
Is it still on "Rev" when you reboot the inverter?
You may need to set it to "Rev", exit the WiFi tab (any other tab), and then restart it.